Windows 10 is dead, switch to Linux!

xropi

@LibreChessChicken said in #119:
I'm not saying linux is total crap but it's by far not the shiny perfect tool many want us to look at it. So lemme take the other side.

I missed a super important negative feature: linux demands the user to be aware of its internals, and hence it's totally not user-friendly
Lemme give an archaic but true example: since when a plain user has to know how to recompile kernel to hack in a driver for a HW? Don't tell me it's not true, I've seen it. (a long time ago, it's true)

More: though it's console based, there's no decent TUI editor for linux. The best is 'micro' (an upgrade from the infamous 'nano'), but it's still a piece of crap...
don't mention vim, it's not an editor; it's modal and users have to google how to exit from it so it doesn't count as a user application :D
So lack of decent TUI editor is just a shame on the linux community after 3+ decades.

One more: bad defaults.
Like LD_LIBRARY_PATH doesn't include '.' - what a capital blunder :D so you can't just easily deploy a program with all it's dependencies (to somewhat fight binary hell)
Or you must use ./script.sh instead of just script.sh because '.' is not on PATH by default - stuff like that go on my nerves...

ugly gui
NOT TRUE although an subjective topic
it's ugly.
but it's also true that it's subjective

cryptic settings
I don't know where you got this, but i don't think so
/etc/profile.d and friedns

binary hell
this is not a problem for most users. i would like to point out the opposite, that multiple binaries and packaging formats like flatpak, snaps and appimages are available for linux, which is a pro
On a certain ubuntu version (18.04 I think) I thought it would be great if I just naively updated python3 version...
Huge regret, faulty boot followed, I had to emergency hack the system back to life.

Or have you ever fought incompatible packages installed and fix system one-by-one? - it's a pleasure

Or have you tried to just run an app from pendrive on another system? It'll likely crash. Even within same distro, if OS version is different, portability is not guaranteed - I've seen it, had to recompile my program on other OS...

BTW, the death of linux is what they call it's strength: 1000's of distros. No We don't need 1000. We need just ONE that works good. 1000 distros create more problems than what they solve.

dodgy clipboard
?? what does this mean?
I've experienced that ctrl-c / ctrl-v vs shift-del / shift-insert work differently, and in some situations these didn't work out of the box
between a gui app and console or between two concoles

no games
not true. you can install steam on linux, there are many games for linux like 0AD, Unciv
it's true, and you know it :)
steam... mostly emulation of windows and it sometimes works

no apps
not true at all, unless you only count windows apps as apps.
I mean no apps that matter except a handful. 'terminator' or 'blender' are not a bad on linux.
but
good video player - missing, ableton live - missing, total commander - missing, visual studio - missing, premiere pro - missing and the list goes on and on (big names included)

in many cases forced use of cmd line
totally not true, unless you have specific hardware issues, which is not everyone, and still linux mint makes it easy to do everything graphically
come on, everybody knows it's true

file system is caps sensitive
what are we talking about even? this is not true, all right? you could be talking about older filesystems
linuxisbad.txt is DIFFERENT from linuxIsBad.txt so they can coexist in the same folder.
as a consequence, if you carelessly mix up just one caps in a file name => file not found

tools sensitive to line endings
again, what tools are you talking about. please give more detailed if you've actually experienced problems
dunno, try gcc on main.cpp with CRLF?

bash, make, git surely won't like CRLF

no drive letters
... see here, linux is not designed to be a windows clone, so get used to it.
yep, bad design so it's a minus; drive letters are great shortcuts

crappy dev env
vscode, jetbrains, and lots of dev apps are there
I personally hate vscode - some love it
but there's no visual studio, the king of dev envs...

and the most painful of all: there's no total commander
the person who is sitting at the computer is the master, as long as he knows the root password
FYI, 'total commander' is THE GOTO file manager on win
on linux there're clones but they just don't work and are lame or they are outdated as hell like: midnight commander (TUI)

win wins:

you can use whatever app version you want without having to alter system
this is the same for windows. i seriously don't get your purpose here

all graphics APIs are available

driver support

there's wsl2 if you need linux - it's included

easy access to key system indicators

this section was the "where windows is a win" - maybe it makes sense now
in windows you CAN update your python (or whatever app) if you wanted to or downgrade it without having to alter your OS...
windows takes great care of compatibility of apps, while linux gives a F (yes, the same linux binary hell again)

@LibreChessChicken said in #119: I'm not saying linux is total crap but it's by far not the shiny perfect tool many want us to look at it. So lemme take the other side. I missed a super important negative feature: linux demands the user to be aware of its internals, and hence it's totally not user-friendly Lemme give an archaic but true example: since when a plain user has to know how to recompile kernel to hack in a driver for a HW? Don't tell me it's not true, I've seen it. (a long time ago, it's true) More: though it's console based, there's no decent TUI editor for linux. The best is 'micro' (an upgrade from the infamous 'nano'), but it's still a piece of crap... don't mention vim, it's not an editor; it's modal and users have to google how to exit from it so it doesn't count as a user application :D So lack of decent TUI editor is just a shame on the linux community after 3+ decades. One more: bad defaults. Like LD_LIBRARY_PATH doesn't include '.' - what a capital blunder :D so you can't just easily deploy a program with all it's dependencies (to somewhat fight binary hell) Or you must use ./script.sh instead of just script.sh because '.' is not on PATH by default - stuff like that go on my nerves... > >- ugly gui > NOT TRUE although an subjective topic it's ugly. but it's also true that it's subjective > >- cryptic settings > I don't know where you got this, but i don't think so /etc/profile.d and friedns > >- binary hell > this is not a problem for most users. i would like to point out the opposite, that multiple binaries and packaging formats like flatpak, snaps and appimages are available for linux, which is a pro On a certain ubuntu version (18.04 I think) I thought it would be great if I just naively updated python3 version... Huge regret, faulty boot followed, I had to emergency hack the system back to life. Or have you ever fought incompatible packages installed and fix system one-by-one? - it's a pleasure Or have you tried to just run an app from pendrive on another system? It'll likely crash. Even within same distro, if OS version is different, portability is not guaranteed - I've seen it, had to recompile my program on other OS... BTW, the death of linux is what they call it's strength: 1000's of distros. No We don't need 1000. We need just ONE that works good. 1000 distros create more problems than what they solve. > >- dodgy clipboard > ?? what does this mean? I've experienced that ctrl-c / ctrl-v vs shift-del / shift-insert work differently, and in some situations these didn't work out of the box between a gui app and console or between two concoles > >- no games > not true. you can install steam on linux, there are many games for linux like 0AD, Unciv it's true, and you know it :) steam... mostly emulation of windows and it _sometimes_ works > >- no apps > not true at all, unless you only count windows apps as apps. I mean no apps that _matter_ except a handful. 'terminator' or 'blender' are not a bad on linux. but good video player - missing, ableton live - missing, total commander - missing, visual studio - missing, premiere pro - missing and the list goes on and on (big names included) > >- in many cases forced use of cmd line > totally not true, unless you have specific hardware issues, which is not everyone, and still linux mint makes it easy to do everything graphically come on, everybody knows it's true > >- file system is caps sensitive > what are we talking about even? this is not true, all right? you could be talking about older filesystems linuxisbad.txt is DIFFERENT from linuxIsBad.txt so they can coexist in the same folder. as a consequence, if you carelessly mix up just one caps in a file name => file not found > >- tools sensitive to line endings > again, what tools are you talking about. please give more detailed if you've actually experienced problems dunno, try gcc on main.cpp with CRLF? bash, make, git surely won't like CRLF > >- no drive letters > ... see here, linux is not designed to be a windows clone, so get used to it. yep, bad design so it's a minus; drive letters are great shortcuts > >- crappy dev env > vscode, jetbrains, and lots of dev apps are there I personally hate vscode - some love it but there's no visual studio, the king of dev envs... > >- and the most painful of all: there's no total commander > the person who is sitting at the computer is the master, as long as he knows the root password FYI, 'total commander' is THE GOTO file manager on win on linux there're clones but they just don't work and are lame or they are outdated as hell like: midnight commander (TUI) > >win wins: > >- you can use whatever app version you want without having to alter system > this is the same for windows. i seriously don't get your purpose here > >- all graphics APIs are available > >- driver support > >- there's wsl2 if you need linux - it's included > >- easy access to key system indicators > this section was the "where windows is a win" - maybe it makes sense now in windows you CAN update your python (or whatever app) if you wanted to or downgrade it without having to alter your OS... windows takes great care of compatibility of apps, while linux gives a F (yes, the same linux binary hell again)

moonpiedumplings

Fun fact: Lichess has a tux flair!

dolynachess

Can I install Swiss-Manager and ChessBase on Linux?

CatalanSpammer

Didn’t know we would have advertisements on Lichess in the big 2025

OuF4

why are you so happy about it lol

LibreChessChicken

@xropi said in #139:

I'm not saying linux is total crap but it's by far not the shiny perfect tool many want us to look at it. So lemme take the other side.
windows is not shiny at all. unless you count some makeup on windows 98 shiny
I missed a super important negative feature: linux demands the user to be aware of its internals, and hence it's totally not user-friendly
that's not true. you absolutely DON'T need the terminal unless you have SPECIFIC hardware
Lemme give an archaic but true example: since when a plain user has to know how to recompile kernel to hack in a driver for a HW? Don't tell me it's not true, I've seen it. (a long time ago, it's true)
Nobody is expected or required to recompile the kernel. even if it's true, THIS IS NOT THE CASE NOW.
More: though it's console based, there's no decent TUI editor for linux. The best is 'micro' (an upgrade from the infamous 'nano'), but it's still a piece of crap...
don't mention vim, it's not an editor; it's modal and users have to google how to exit from it so it doesn't count as a user application :D
So lack of decent TUI editor is just a shame on the linux community after 3+ decades.
You just didn't take time to learn one. anybody will tell you vim and neovim are awesome, although i don't think tui apps are necessary now, for the average person
it's ugly.
there is not single ui that represents linux, and furthermore, as linux is just the kernel, and it not dependant on any gui, you can run it headless. most people will prefer having a desktop environment like kde plasma, gnome, cinnamon, and even a window manager, like i3, sway, or hyprland. there are extensions and settings for desktop environments to change how it looks, while you can customize or RICE the window managers yourself, or by borrowing someone else's code
/etc/profile.d and friedns
you don't need to manually edit config files, there are graphical tools like settings for that
On a certain ubuntu version (18.04 I think) I thought it would be great if I just naively updated python3 version...
Huge regret, faulty boot followed, I had to emergency hack the system back to life.
that is from 2018, if you didn't know what the 18 stands for. As I've said, you cannot simply compare the linux desktop of today to 10, 5, even just a few years ago.
Or have you ever fought incompatible packages installed and fix system one-by-one? - it's a pleasure
if you really hate that, you can just use an atomic distro like Silverblue, opensuse micro, or NixOS.
Or have you tried to just run an app from pendrive on another system? It'll likely crash. Even within same distro, if OS version is different, portability is not guaranteed - I've seen it, had to recompile my program on other OS...
why aren't you using appimages, flatpak, snaps, anything like that?
BTW, the death of linux is what they call it's strength: 1000's of distros. No We don't need 1000. We need just ONE that works good. 1000 distros create more problems than what they solve.
as i've said, linux isn't ONE SYSTEM, but there are multiple systems designed for multiple use cases, following multiple principals and philosophies, with multiple release models, and project goals. you can't simply just say linux is bad because you have overwhelming choice
I've experienced that ctrl-c / ctrl-v vs shift-del / shift-insert work differently, and in some situations these didn't work out of the box
that might be app-specific problems
between a gui app and console or between two concoles
you should use CTRL+SHIFT+C/V in your terminal emulator
steam... mostly emulation of windows and it sometimes works
i don't have time for games, but i would say (from what i've heard) linux gaming is years ahead of mac gaming
I mean no apps that matter except a handful. 'terminator' or 'blender' are not a bad on linux.
of course those aren't bad. BLENDER is PROFESSIONAL software.
good video player - missing, ableton live - missing, total commander - missing, visual studio - missing, premiere pro - missing and the list goes on and on (big names included)
VLC, mpv for video player, ARDOUR for DAW, VSCODE/VSCODIUM is available, KDENLIVE the best video editor is available..
linuxisbad.txt is DIFFERENT from linuxIsBad.txt so they can coexist in the same folder.
as a consequence, if you carelessly mix up just one caps in a file name => file not found
THAT'S SIMPLY NOT TRUE. if you took one second to search about it, ask an ai, or just tried it in a vm, you would know that that is not true, and if it was ever true, it's on archaic filesystems.. like fat does that i think on my usb drive..
dunno, try gcc on main.cpp with CRLF?
bash, make, git surely won't like CRLF
i don't know about that
yep, bad design so it's a minus; drive letters are great shortcuts
a great file manager, like dolphin or nautilus is all we need, ok?
I personally hate vscode - some love it
but there's no visual studio, the king of dev envs...
what's different?
FYI, 'total commander' is THE GOTO file manager on win
on linux there're clones but they just don't work and are lame or they are outdated as hell like: midnight commander (TUI)
there are loads of tui file managers on linux.
this section was the "where windows is a win" - maybe it makes sense now
in windows you CAN update your python (or whatever app) if you wanted to or downgrade it without having to alter your OS...
i've used python on linux for years, and i haven't found updates errors yet.
windows takes great care of compatibility of apps, while linux gives a F (yes, the same linux binary hell again)
that's the app developer's problem, and not linux's problem.

From what i see, you have tried linux like 10 or more YEARS before, and have the impression that it is still as BAD as before, when it is COMPLETELY NOT the case. Or, you might just be trolling (I'm not accusing you though). Please do not spread disinformation that is completely based on personal experience and opinions. Thank you.

@xropi said in #139: > I'm not saying linux is total crap but it's by far not the shiny perfect tool many want us to look at it. So lemme take the other side. windows is not shiny at all. unless you count some makeup on windows 98 shiny > I missed a super important negative feature: linux demands the user to be aware of its internals, and hence it's totally not user-friendly that's not true. you absolutely DON'T need the terminal unless you have SPECIFIC hardware > Lemme give an archaic but true example: since when a plain user has to know how to recompile kernel to hack in a driver for a HW? Don't tell me it's not true, I've seen it. (a long time ago, it's true) Nobody is expected or required to recompile the kernel. even if it's true, THIS IS NOT THE CASE NOW. > More: though it's console based, there's no decent TUI editor for linux. The best is 'micro' (an upgrade from the infamous 'nano'), but it's still a piece of crap... > don't mention vim, it's not an editor; it's modal and users have to google how to exit from it so it doesn't count as a user application :D > So lack of decent TUI editor is just a shame on the linux community after 3+ decades. You just didn't take time to learn one. anybody will tell you vim and neovim are awesome, although i don't think tui apps are necessary now, for the average person > it's ugly. there is not single ui that represents linux, and furthermore, as linux is just the kernel, and it not dependant on any gui, you can run it headless. most people will prefer having a desktop environment like kde plasma, gnome, cinnamon, and even a window manager, like i3, sway, or hyprland. there are extensions and settings for desktop environments to change how it looks, while you can customize or RICE the window managers yourself, or by borrowing someone else's code > /etc/profile.d and friedns you don't need to manually edit config files, there are graphical tools like settings for that > On a certain ubuntu version (18.04 I think) I thought it would be great if I just naively updated python3 version... > Huge regret, faulty boot followed, I had to emergency hack the system back to life. that is from 2018, if you didn't know what the 18 stands for. As I've said, you cannot simply compare the linux desktop of today to 10, 5, even just a few years ago. > Or have you ever fought incompatible packages installed and fix system one-by-one? - it's a pleasure if you really hate that, you can just use an atomic distro like Silverblue, opensuse micro, or NixOS. > Or have you tried to just run an app from pendrive on another system? It'll likely crash. Even within same distro, if OS version is different, portability is not guaranteed - I've seen it, had to recompile my program on other OS... why aren't you using appimages, flatpak, snaps, anything like that? > BTW, the death of linux is what they call it's strength: 1000's of distros. No We don't need 1000. We need just ONE that works good. 1000 distros create more problems than what they solve. as i've said, linux isn't ONE SYSTEM, but there are multiple systems designed for multiple use cases, following multiple principals and philosophies, with multiple release models, and project goals. you can't simply just say linux is bad because you have overwhelming choice > I've experienced that ctrl-c / ctrl-v vs shift-del / shift-insert work differently, and in some situations these didn't work out of the box that might be app-specific problems > between a gui app and console or between two concoles you should use CTRL+SHIFT+C/V in your terminal emulator > steam... mostly emulation of windows and it _sometimes_ works i don't have time for games, but i would say (from what i've heard) linux gaming is years ahead of mac gaming > I mean no apps that _matter_ except a handful. 'terminator' or 'blender' are not a bad on linux. of course those aren't bad. BLENDER is PROFESSIONAL software. > good video player - missing, ableton live - missing, total commander - missing, visual studio - missing, premiere pro - missing and the list goes on and on (big names included) VLC, mpv for video player, ARDOUR for DAW, VSCODE/VSCODIUM is available, KDENLIVE the best video editor is available.. > linuxisbad.txt is DIFFERENT from linuxIsBad.txt so they can coexist in the same folder. > as a consequence, if you carelessly mix up just one caps in a file name => file not found THAT'S SIMPLY NOT TRUE. if you took one second to search about it, ask an ai, or just tried it in a vm, you would know that that is not true, and if it was ever true, it's on archaic filesystems.. like fat does that i think on my usb drive.. > dunno, try gcc on main.cpp with CRLF? > bash, make, git surely won't like CRLF i don't know about that > yep, bad design so it's a minus; drive letters are great shortcuts a great file manager, like dolphin or nautilus is all we need, ok? > I personally hate vscode - some love it > but there's no visual studio, the king of dev envs... what's different? > FYI, 'total commander' is THE GOTO file manager on win > on linux there're clones but they just don't work and are lame or they are outdated as hell like: midnight commander (TUI) there are loads of tui file managers on linux. > this section was the "where windows is a win" - maybe it makes sense now > in windows you CAN update your python (or whatever app) if you wanted to or downgrade it without having to alter your OS... i've used python on linux for years, and i haven't found updates errors yet. > windows takes great care of compatibility of apps, while linux gives a F (yes, the same linux binary hell again) that's the app developer's problem, and not linux's problem. From what i see, you have tried linux like 10 or more YEARS before, and have the impression that it is still as BAD as before, when it is COMPLETELY NOT the case. Or, you might just be trolling (I'm not accusing you though). Please do not spread disinformation that is completely based on personal experience and opinions. Thank you.

LibreChessChicken

@dolynachess said in #141:

Can I install Swiss-Manager and ChessBase on Linux?
I'm not sure about that, but check out encroissant if you're interested.

https://encroissant.org/

scid works with most db formats too btw

@dolynachess said in #141: > Can I install Swiss-Manager and ChessBase on Linux? I'm not sure about that, but check out encroissant if you're interested. https://encroissant.org/ scid works with most db formats too btw

LarsenB

Given the amount of times Windows has been declared dead in the past 15 years, I am starting to believe in the afterlife and reincarnation...